reliability ?

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reliability ?

bloglo
Hi,

I ordered a 500 back in march and the ETA was last week. So it should be here this week.

I still have a possibility to cancel everything...

So far, my biggest concern is the long term reliability. Many people have serious doupts about the reliability, including one of my close friend who's a mechanic and work at a subaru dealer after 15 years in an honda dealer. He clearly told me to walk out and get a car with a good reputation... Chrysler doe'snt have a big reputation for quality, Fiat neither and Mexican build cars have horrible reputations. So that dos'nt look very well. the chrysler, fiat  & mexican combination could be a recipe for catastrophe.

So far, on this board, we have seen some cases of very poor initial quality, but some people seems very happy with the car. On the board, we have seen a case of blown motor with only a few miles on it, poor sheetmetal (could mean a lot of rust in a few years), badly made paint job, broken plastics, electronic problems (blue&me, engine controls)

I will have to communute 45 miles a day in that car and I can't afford to be left without a car if that car is to spend a lot of time in the service bay. My job need me to be there, on time, every weekday.

the expresso sport 500 with marrone interior is about to be here, my heart and soul say get it, my rational brain say get out as soon as you can and get a proven reliable car.

after months of wait, a deposit at the dealer, I still don't know what to do.  
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Re: reliability ?

ciddyguy
bloglo wrote
Hi,

I ordered a 500 back in march and the ETA was last week. So it should be here this week.

I still have a possibility to cancel everything...

So far, my biggest concern is the long term reliability. Many people have serious doupts about the reliability, including one of my close friend who's a mechanic and work at a subaru dealer after 15 years in an honda dealer. He clearly told me to walk out and get a car with a good reputation... Chrysler doe'snt have a big reputation for quality, Fiat neither and Mexican build cars have horrible reputations. So that dos'nt look very well. the chrysler, fiat  & mexican combination could be a recipe for catastrophe.

So far, on this board, we have seen some cases of very poor initial quality, but some people seems very happy with the car. On the board, we have seen a case of blown motor with only a few miles on it, poor sheetmetal (could mean a lot of rust in a few years), badly made paint job, broken plastics, electronic problems (blue&me, engine controls)

I will have to communute 45 miles a day in that car and I can't afford to be left without a car if that car is to spend a lot of time in the service bay. My job need me to be there, on time, every weekday.

the expresso sport 500 with marrone interior is about to be here, my heart and soul say get it, my rational brain say get out as soon as you can and get a proven reliable car.

after months of wait, a deposit at the dealer, I still don't know what to do.
I'd say it's definitely an unknown but look at how the car fairs in Europe, Both the Panda, from which this car is based and the 500, which are made in Tichy Poland have fared very well and many of their other cars built in Italy have also been faring much better than in the past.

Fiat uses galvanized sheet metal for ALL critical areas of the car where rust is an issue and is considered one of the most rust resistant cars built - as are most cars today, there ARE exceptions.

The blown motor may well have been nothing more than a defective head gasket, another car with sheet metal problems looks to have had issues that stemmed from shipping with the scratched bumper, the issues there had NOTHING to do with Fiat itself, but the dealer whom told the shop to rush the job and Fiat, once told of the situation got right on the case and nipped it in the bud.

Plus, this is a new car, built in a new factory (a pre-existing factory that built the PT Cruiser which WAS fairly reliable) on a dealer network that's getting set up after a 27 year hiatus.

I have faith that what we are seeing are anomalies in early production, plus compounded by a new parts supply chain as many of the parts necessary for the car are sourced here in the US as well as abroad as the motor is built here in Dundee MI and an early head gasket failure CAN occur in just about any other car as well.

Not to say that Fiat will immediately beat Toyota and Honda in warranty claims early on, but I think in the end, they'll have put their past reputation behind them and seem to be doing so in Europe.

I'm buying a Fiat if I can swing for it.
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Thad
In reply to this post by bloglo
The mechanic obviously has no idea of what Fiat has been up to for the last 30 years. The factory at Toluca -I believe- had one of the best reputations for quality. FYI the 500 has been on the streets since 2007 and was Euro Car of the Year in 2008. They built over a half million of them a year ago. It's not an unproven design.
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5*(10)^2
In reply to this post by bloglo
If you have doubts now, don't get it. Trust me. I had doubts like yours. Even on the day itself, I was asking my wife "Should we get it?". We went ahead. What a regret.
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Re: reliability ?

Giallo Edizione
5*(10)^2 wrote
If you have doubts now, don't get it. Trust me. I had doubts like yours. Even on the day itself, I was asking my wife "Should we get it?". We went ahead. What a regret.
That's just a damn shame. Can happen with any car I suppose.
Giallo Sport "Enzo" (formerly PE 311. We don't need no steenkeeng badges)
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Fiat500USA
Administrator
I once bought an Audi that I kept for 12 years. The first 9 months it was at the dealership constantly with warranty repairs that amounted to $12,000 in parts alone. After that, it was a great car, no problems and 210,000 miles.

If you are concerned, why not wait a few months until the dealers and the organization have settled down to a normal routine. Most of the issues I hear about can be attributed to everything (cars/network) being brand new. Remember, most everyone here has a car that is from the first production run from January.

After that, I wouldn't worry... the Fiat has a lot better warranty than an Audi;)
Prima Edizione  29
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bloglo
In reply to this post by bloglo
The car is arrived at the dealer,

saw it yesterday and drove it for a test drive.

My heart say even more "get it".

I still have to go thru the actual signing process.

The commercial director is still trying to push all extras and fees down my throat. More than 3000$ of fees, additionnal insurance, additionnal warranty, antirust treatment, antitheft marking, accessories, scotchguard and other ADP (additionnal dealer profits). When I ordered the car back in march, it was supposed to be sold without any dealer fees or doc fees. Only MSRP

once I get him out of my way and get rid of all these, I think i will get the car.

If he still push some fees over MSRP and don't accept the deal agreed in march, I will go across the street at the ford, honda or mazda dealer.

any other suggestion for a nice daily commuter, fuel sipper and in the same price range or less than the 500?

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kzod
Did you sign a contract when you ordered the car stipulating the "final price" and or fee structure?  If you did and they took your deposit they are legally obligated to follow through on the deal.  Don't let them rip you off.  Besides with a car that you should hopefully want to9 keep for years do you truly want to be stuck doing business with crooks?  TYhink how bad you'll get ripped off on service down the road if they start like this now.  Remember the sales is typically the clean part of buying a car, the service people can be the worst crooks in the business.  
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sjmst
I drive 100 miles per day. I got the car on March 28th. I already have 3500 miles on it.
The clock may lose a minute every two weeks. I am keeping an eye on that.
Other than that the car has been flawless. No design or manufacturing defects, perfect fit and finish, everything works as it should, feels solid as a steel vault. I don't have the slightest doubt this will give me years of trouble free service.
Sam

Prima #499... Rossa.
Original Owner, 81 Fiat Spider.

Past Italians:

1991 Alfa 164b
1991 Alfa 164L
1994 Alfa 164LS
1995 Alfa 164LS
1991 Alfa Spider
1982 Ferrari Mondial
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Re: reliability ?

bloglo
finally the car will be home in a few hour.

Cleared up the sales bill to the price i had planned.

got the financing, insurance and paperwork done.

I hope for the best and look forward to a few years of trouble free happy commuting.

I will be part of the gang tonight

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Thad
Excellent news! Come and join us at www.flu.org. We have a very exciting convention planned for July in Nashville.
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Fiat500USA
Administrator
In reply to this post by bloglo
bloglo wrote
finally the car will be home in a few hour.

Cleared up the sales bill to the price i had planned.

got the financing, insurance and paperwork done.

I hope for the best and look forward to a few years of trouble free happy commuting.

I will be part of the gang tonight
Congratulations and welcome to the family!
Prima Edizione  29
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rossonero404
In reply to this post by bloglo
The good news is, this car comes with a great warranty, plus the option for more years at time of purchase.

Did anyone else get offered the 'Lifetime" warranty?  Cost $3,000 more, but if you really think about it, whats $3,000 if you plan on owning this car for a very long time, especially if you have a numbered car like the Prima.  I didn't get it, but i really thought about it.
Prima Edizione #404
Rosso

Forza Milan!
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Re: reliability ?

FIAT Specialist
In reply to this post by kzod
I am a certified Fiat Specialist and hearing that breaks my heart.  That person was obviously not re-trained because at our dealership it has been continuously stressed that we need to be completley honest and forward about every aspect of the process.  It does seem like that dealer is trying to screw you over and you should tell him that you would like to deal with the manager.  It does not work like that at other FIAT Studio's and I apologize for you having this troubling experience.  
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middleton
While Fiat / CC tries to screen it's dealers,  Let;s  face it You have to have car people to sell cars.   The New car hustle has developed in the USA for 60 or 70 years.   You can't just change the title from "Salesman" to "Specialist" and expect lead to change to  Gold.   The F and I  (Finance and Insurance) guy is the most money making person in the building.   Yea my Fiat Dealer sent me to an F and I guy for the Upsale of Junk.  Opps,  he is now called the "Business Manager".
Don
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Don
In reply to this post by bloglo
While many seem to relate the current Fiat to other Italian vehicles costing much more, don't forget that the Yugo (a mechanical disaster) was essentially a rebadged Fiat.  Good luck!
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Disapointed
In reply to this post by kzod
I went to test drive the convertable on a Sunday at 3:30PM.   Loved the car.   by 4:45 I had a pirce on a contract, but needed to bring other half in Monday to also test drive car.  The sales person was fine with that, but the manager of the dealership  (actually he came over from the Crystler dealership next door) said if I walked out without a deposit and signature, the deal was off, and the car would be $3000 more Monday at 9AM when they opened.   Ha, who would want to deal with someone like that.   Needless to say, I bought a honda Civic 2012.     Thought those days of PUSHY dealerships were over.     Too bad Fiat, you lost a customer.   And I buy a car every 2 years or less.  
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yankee2
In reply to this post by Don
The engineering is only one of the factors determining the quality of a car. The manufacture and cost limitations are also important. The Yugoslav was built in an Eastern European factory, with little (or no) experience in quality automobile manufacturing, at a lower price than their Western European counterparts, leading to major compromises in materials, tolerances and QC. Though the Yugoslav may have been based on a Fiat, that fact is nearly IRRELEVANT.

That said, I too am a bit concerned about Fiat quality, due to Fiat's poor reliability history. However, Fiat is the most popular make in the world, and we haven't had 'em here for 40 years. How wrong could all those millions of (European and worldwide) buyers be?

I just rented one for 10 days,and I like it. I may give Fiat another chance.

One thing is sure, they ARE a neat little package.X8VC
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Anthony
In reply to this post by bloglo
I live in the uk and i have had my car for just over 2 years, to be honest is it cheap and cheerful, yes. If your looking for a long term car, then the fiat will look the part even in 10 years like the new mini however I have had steering and engine issues since owning it and I have only clocked 6500 mile (10,000km). Also I don't know if it's the same in the US as it is in europe but fiat only offer a 2 yr manufactures warranty the 3rd year is a 3rd party warranty you know those ones that exclude everything. If I'm honest if I could go back I wouldn't buy an Italian car again and stick to German or Japanese as they are solid.
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davespet
I have a manual 2012 Fiat 500 cabrio that now has 9500 kms on it after 6 months use from new. We love the car itself and all of the features and drive characteristics. We are averaging 5.7 l/100 kms or 50 mpg! However after 3 attempts to fix an annoying drivers side mirror vibration, the dealership and Fiat are now saying it is a characteristic of the car and they cannot fix it. The passenger side is fine. Does any other 500 owner see vibration of the mirror on any moderately rough road surface? Also I have 3 other reliability issues yet to be fixed, 2 for the 2nd time of occurance. After a lovely summer with the soft-top down most days the cooler weather has approached and when I went to switch on the rear window defroster for the 1st time ever (de fogger in Canada), it failed to work and the dealership has to order a complete new rear window from Mexico. Then for a second time the soft top fails to open in steps, and I have to keep my finger on the switch to open or close it, plus this seems to be coupled to the trunk release failing to activate. I have to ask a rear passenger to get out whilst I climb into the back seat, pull it down and access the inside trunk release every time I want to put something in it. These happened for the first time a month ago and they reprogrammed the systems. 2 weeks ago it happened again, so I said until you have all the parts and a 2nd plan in place I am refusing to keep coming in for a temporary fixes. My dealerships service manager is called Tim, so it it getting to be "Fix it again Tim, not Tony". You have to keep a sense of humour. In Canada we do not have a lemon law. Fiat have already told me that they will not ever replace the car if these problems persist.
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